Manila International Airport

[Arianespace]

Well, they have this already, also connected to the airport



And here is your bus going there

[Arianespace]

Arianespace wrote

Airside at Terminal III International is really a traffic jam nowadays with managers from Singapore based airlines complaining about their gates being occupied by 5J domestic. This has become a daily occurrence now. Observed it myself. 3 planes are in the taxiway waiting to dock for as long as 1 hour and 30 minutes. You could be in Davao at that time. And yet we are still praying for 15 million more.

Here is Boo commenting the same thing two months later

“Our plane landed at 10:40 p.m., SQ 918. At Terminal 3. The plane waited on the apron for one hour for a parking slot. Then it took another 1.5 hours to clear immigration and get our luggage. Walkalator, escalator out of service. Claim carousel seems never maintained – all torn-up na. I got home three hours later at 2 a.m. in Quezon City. Hayy! Welcome home!”

I checked what went wrong. Apparently, NAIA had a taxiway congestion and a breakdown of the boarding bridges. Those boarding bridges had always been problematic at Terminal 3. I understand that those lightning alerts need not paralyze all operations if NAIA had the right equipment in their boarding bridges that will allow an incoming plane to attach to it without help from people on the ground waving semaphore flags. The planes using NAIA are mostly state of the art in required equipment but T3 is not.
https://www.philstar.com/business/2024/06/03/2359860/airport-reform

Would San Miguel solve It? Highly doubt it!

[airline_builder]

Arianespace wrote

Arianespace wrote

Airside at Terminal III International is really a traffic jam nowadays with managers from Singapore based airlines complaining about their gates being occupied by 5J domestic. This has become a daily occurrence now. Observed it myself. 3 planes are in the taxiway waiting to dock for as long as 1 hour and 30 minutes. You could be in Davao at that time. And yet we are still praying for 15 million more.

Here is Boo commenting the same thing two months later

“Our plane landed at 10:40 p.m., SQ 918. At Terminal 3. The plane waited on the apron for one hour for a parking slot. Then it took another 1.5 hours to clear immigration and get our luggage. Walkalator, escalator out of service. Claim carousel seems never maintained – all torn-up na. I got home three hours later at 2 a.m. in Quezon City. Hayy! Welcome home!”

I checked what went wrong. Apparently, NAIA had a taxiway congestion and a breakdown of the boarding bridges. Those boarding bridges had always been problematic at Terminal 3. I understand that those lightning alerts need not paralyze all operations if NAIA had the right equipment in their boarding bridges that will allow an incoming plane to attach to it without help from people on the ground waving semaphore flags. The planes using NAIA are mostly state of the art in required equipment but T3 is not.
https://www.philstar.com/business/2024/06/03/2359860/airport-reform

Would San Miguel solve It? Highly doubt it!

someone from the inner circle of the SMC team has mentioned that it will be RSA's first lady who is "hands on deck" on the NAIA take over......so let us see how these things unravel commencing September

[Arianespace]

Cebu Pacific hopes SMC can fulfill its promise to the Department of Transportation (DOTr) of increasing aircraft movement in NAIA to 48 per hour from 40 at present.
https://www.philstar.com/business/2024/06/11/2361832/cebu-pacific-bets-expansion-new-naia

CEB will be in for a big surprise. ATC is not one of those to be improve by SMC. Terminals and Aprons are. Grandiose dreams without reading the contract sometimes makes a political bruhaha, laughing stock to be exact.

[JNC03]

Well CEB needs space for their new planes

[xzibit31]

JNC03 wrote

Well CEB needs space for their new planes

I just talked with an insider from 5J when I was in Manila a couple of weeks back and he mentioned that 5J will be reopening their DVO hub later this year. He mentioned that with the reopening of the hub, 5J will be stationing 321's, 320's, ATR's, and a 330. The 330 stationing will be done by 2nd half of next year.

[Arianespace]

Aviation groups ask DOTr: Stop ‘gargantuan’ hike in Naia fees

Stakeholders in the country’s aviation industry have appealed to the Department of Transportation (DOTr) to stop the looming increase in landing and takeoff fees and other charges that they claim would make the soon-to-be privatized Ninoy Aquino International Airport (Naia) the most expensive airport in Asia.

In a recent letter to Transportation Secretary Jaime Bautista, the Air Carriers Association of the Philippines, the Board of Airline Representatives and the Airline Operators Council said they “view with grave concern the impending gargantuan increase of fees and charges coinciding with the recently awarded privatization of the Naia.”

the passenger service charge for local travelers will almost double to P390 from P200 in the first year under the consortium. The service charge for international travelers, on the other hand, will surge by 73 percent to P950 from P550.

The passenger fees as well as the proposed increases in aeronautical and other charges were deemed by aviation groups as unreasonable and unaffordable.

They warned that Naia’s proposed landing and takeoff fees charged to the airlines would be double that of Singapore’s Changi Airport and more than triple that of other Southeast Asian airports.

The increases are reportedly about $2,000 more than those collected at the Tokyo-Narita airport, which is generally considered one of the most expensive in Asia.

MIAA earlier posted the proposed revised schedule of fees on its official website, but it has since been inaccessible for still undisclosed reasons.
https://www.msn.com/en-ph/travel/news/aviation-groups-ask-dotr-stop-gargantuan-hike-in-naia-fees/ar-BB1ofDXB?rc=1&ocid=winp1taskbar&pc=oneClick&cvid=f89a62d2134946a690076a9b0da1a064&ei=12

The price you pay for ₱170B. This is expected. All fees will rise. And these fees will all be shouldered by passengers. Expect ticket prices to significantly rise in 2025.

The intent is to moved out LCC operations eventually to New Manila by 2028. NAIA will have all legacy airlines.

[JNC03]

The Gokongwei family’s Cebu Pacific is actively collaborating with the San Miguel Corp.-led consortium, which will soon take over operations at Ninoy Aquino International Airport (NAIA), to streamline operations and enhance passenger experience, particularly at Terminal 3.

In a recent meeting, Cebu Pacific officials, led by President Xander Lao, underscored their commitment to partnering with NNIC to implement significant enhancements in passenger services.

The budget carrier is particularly focused on maintaining its position as NAIA’s largest operator in terms of passenger volume and fleet size.

“We look forward to gaining insights into NNIC’s plans for meaningful improvements in customer service and operational efficiency through ongoing discussions,” Lao told Bilyonaryo.com.

Cebu Pacific has identified several key areas for improvement, including upgrades to the baggage handling system, the introduction of mobile boarding passes for international flights, and investments in modern flight information screens and expanded seating areas.


https://bilyonaryo.com/2024/06/28/faster-check-ins-more-flights-seats-cebu-pacific-smc-collaborate-to-elevate-naia-t3-experience/travel/

[JNC03]

The plan of RSA, however, Bautista said, is to build a bigger and better T2 than what was agreed in the contract without any additional cost to the government. The planned expansion would eventually consolidate all domestic flights in T2, including those of Cebu Pacific so that operations of Terminal 3 would be for other international flights.

RSA’s daughter, Cecile, personally visits NAIA everyday to check on what needs further improvement

SMC, Bautista said, “is thinking of removing some of the hangars para humaba ang runaway... so that they have more flights using that runway...which will increase the capacity of the runways from 38 movements per hour to 48 movements per hour, or (at least) a 20 percent increase.”


https://www.philstar.com/business/2024/07/15/2370147/rsa-deliver-more-agreed

[Arianespace]

JNC03 wrote

The plan of RSA, however, Bautista said, is to build a bigger and better T2 than what was agreed in the contract without any additional cost to the government. The planned expansion would eventually consolidate all domestic flights in T2, including those of Cebu Pacific so that operations of Terminal 3 would be for other international flights.

RSA’s daughter, Cecile, personally visits NAIA everyday to check on what needs further improvement

SMC, Bautista said, “is thinking of removing some of the hangars para humaba ang runaway... so that they have more flights using that runway...which will increase the capacity of the runways from 38 movements per hour to 48 movements per hour, or (at least) a 20 percent increase.”


https://www.philstar.com/business/2024/07/15/2370147/rsa-deliver-more-agreed

Arianespace wrote

SMC is proposing this as new Terminal 4 or 5, while MIAA would like it T2 extension. Lets see what they would come up with come September.

I said this in March and will say it again now. It was MIAA idea to have T2 extension. Not SMC as they wanted to build a new terminal. See how the narrative unfold. JJB credits it now to RSA. That is what we call gentlemen "Politics of attribution."

And of course, it has without any additional cost to the government because SMC is obliged by the concession agreement to build it themselves. duh

I would also reiterate my previous statements about the private hangars at domestic. If Tugade failed to have these hangars removed, I don't see any reason why JJB could. After all, they are PBBM donors, and some have made it their office in Batasan ang GSIS.

Lets see how tough GM Eric would be clearing General Aviation at domestic.

[airline_builder]

Arianespace wrote

JNC03 wrote

The plan of RSA, however, Bautista said, is to build a bigger and better T2 than what was agreed in the contract without any additional cost to the government. The planned expansion would eventually consolidate all domestic flights in T2, including those of Cebu Pacific so that operations of Terminal 3 would be for other international flights.

RSA’s daughter, Cecile, personally visits NAIA everyday to check on what needs further improvement

SMC, Bautista said, “is thinking of removing some of the hangars para humaba ang runaway... so that they have more flights using that runway...which will increase the capacity of the runways from 38 movements per hour to 48 movements per hour, or (at least) a 20 percent increase.”


https://www.philstar.com/business/2024/07/15/2370147/rsa-deliver-more-agreed

Arianespace wrote

SMC is proposing this as new Terminal 4 or 5, while MIAA would like it T2 extension. Lets see what they would come up with come September.

I said this in March and will say it again now. It was MIAA idea to have T2 extension. Not SMC as they wanted to build a new terminal. See how the narrative unfold. JJB credits it now to RSA. That is what we call gentlemen "Politics of attribution."

And of course, it has without any additional cost to the government because SMC is obliged by the concession agreement to build it themselves. duh

I would also reiterate my previous statements about the private hangars at domestic. If Tugade failed to have these hangars removed, I don't see any reason why JJB could. After all, they are PBBM donors, and some have made it their office in Batasan ang GSIS.

Lets see how tough GM Eric would be clearing General Aviation at domestic.

Totally agree with you Arianespace - that has been a long time puzzle for us at the aviation industry - the original plan under Tugade (but then of course politics and favors placed pretty well, so...) the expenses laid over at Sangley was where the new displaced allegedly gen av would be.

The area of gen av (not considering the NW expansion yet of T2) when totally cleared and that specifically on T4 and the private hangars at the end of 13/31 would have tremendously enhanced the apron area for commercial aircraft space and maximize the runway threshold for take off runs just like that of the San Diego International Airport (restricted space but maxed out for optimum operations)

[Gustavo J Oppenheimer]

Ramon Ang speaking about NAIA Development starting at 17:00 mins

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfrt9Xik9zI

[Arianespace]

Quick answer. SMC is obligated by Contract to build & construct T3, T2, and T1 connectors. Whether he likes it or not. It is also obligated to make a new Terminal whether RSA likes it or not.

All the things his saying, like Terminal capacity adjustment and expansion was already undertaken by MIAA. That is why Terminal 3 is a shitty place carrying more human heat than it is supposed to handle. Its not PBBM or JJB contribution because it was already undertaken by the previous administration. They just reaped the benefit of it now, and of course the congestion it brought. Electric grid and aircon failure. Basic mathematics, gentlemen.

Also, contrary to RSA statement, the two RPLL runways are already separated, as early as Tugade's time.


The only thing that is left is increasing aircraft movement, which is ludicrously stated when you put in equation GA traffic. In short, it can't be done if it continues to handle the GA. Like I said, good luck JJB if he can do that.

[airline_builder]

Arianespace wrote

Quick answer. SMC is obligated by Contract to build & construct T3, T2, and T1 connectors. Whether he likes it or not. It is also obligated to make a new Terminal whether RSA likes it or not.

All the things his saying, like Terminal capacity adjustment and expansion was already undertaken by MIAA. That is why Terminal 3 is a shitty place carrying more human heat than it is supposed to handle. Its not PBBM or JJB contribution because it was already undertaken by the previous administration. They just reaped the benefit of it now, and of course the congestion it brought. Electric grid and aircon failure. Basic mathematics, gentlemen.

Also, contrary to RSA statement, the two RPLL runways are already separated, as early as Tugade's time.


The only thing that is left is increasing aircraft movement, which is ludicrously stated when you put in equation GA traffic. In short, it can't be done if it continues to handle the GA. Like I said, good luck JJB if he can do that.

I had a laugh watching is highly strung oral illustration re NAIA.

I agree to all your observations Arianespace.

On my end, I do not believe in the limitation of intersecting runways, we see that all the time in the highest yielding airports around the world, be it in Europe and the Americas and it all boils down to ATC movement management which we all know are extremely underpaid here in the Philippines thus the exodus to Australia and Canada.

The end of runway 31 can actually still be operated way to the original length across 06/24 with a taxiway Juliet extend alongside it.

We operated flights way back then in the 2000s where we started our take off rolls on the farthest end of runway 31

[idp5601]

Gustavo J Oppenheimer wrote

Ramon Ang speaking about NAIA Development starting at 17:00 mins

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfrt9Xik9zI

Sorry but I don't quite buy the assertion that moving domestic flights out of T3 would somehow make road-based transfers between terminals less of a hassle. While it definitely is the most congested in terms of vehicular traffic, that *entire area* has terrible traffic, no thanks to the bottlenecks that NAIAX introduced. You would literally just be transferring traffic from one side to the other! It would be a temporary fix at best and would be akin to rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic at worst. Hell his last sentence doesn't even answer the terminal connection issue at all! It's great if tourists want to leave the airport and go directly to their destination, pero pano na ang mga turista na kailangang lumipat sa domestic terminals, sasalubungin ba sila ng traffic?

Arianespace wrote

Speaking about public transport to the airport, here is one example of EDSA bus going to T1,T2,T3, and T4. They are there if you only know where to look

AFAIK this service hasn't been offered since after the pandemic, the EDSA buses only go up to L3 Taft station these days.

Arianespace wrote

Quick answer. SMC is obligated by Contract to build & construct T3, T2, and T1 connectors. Whether he likes it or not.

Does the contract stipulate what kind of connector SMC is obligated to build? Or could they get away with just building super-long walkalators underground and call it a day?

[Arianespace]

airline_builder wrote

The end of runway 31 can actually still be operated way to the original length across 06/24 with a taxiway Juliet extend alongside it.

We operated flights way back then in the 2000s where we started our take off rolls on the farthest end of runway 31

And that was the time when A300, the precursor of the A330, fly you from Domestic to CEB and DVO. Imagine, it was operated by a bigger plane which require a longer runway. But of course, there was no Terminal 3 then. Nowadays, PAR requires certain distances between runway and taxiway separations to work with permitted aircraft. Certainly, A330 is not one of them, nor its precursor, the A300.

idp5601 wrote

AFAIK this service hasn't been offered since after the pandemic, the EDSA buses only go up to L3 Taft station these days.

That is current on the date it was posted. So it exist now. Take a look at the EDSA bus lane enforcers.

Does the contract stipulate what kind of connector SMC is obligated to build? Or could they get away with just building super-long walkalators underground and call it a day?

Yes. It appears similar to this one. Two way traffic, exclusive for passengers only. So this is part of sanitized zone. In short, you don't need another security check when arriving at the other end. It will also have provisions for airport passenger carts for mobility impaired between terminals. Transfer is at Terminal 2. Because the other one is overhead and its connector underground. But SMC could do it seamlessly, by adding slanted approaches at T2 enabling the carts to move freely between T1-T3. This provision is discretionary, not mandatory. So either they do put it or they don't. Their call.

T2-T1

https://media.istockphoto.com/id/934315966/photo/passengers-with-luggage-walk-on-a-long-horizontal-escalator-covered-by-a-modern-tunnel-at.jpg

T3-T2

https://www.frankfurt-airport.com/content/dam/fraport-travel/airport/am-flughafen/einrichtungen-und-services/kunst/kunst-tunnel-am-airport.jpg/_jcr_content/renditions/original./kunst-tunnel-am-airport.jpg

It is discretion for airport operator to also construct airside road between T2 and T3. Maybe that is what RSA was talking about, the underground airside road that traverses runway 13-31.

[airline_builder]

Getting back on RSA's interview, I totally disagree that a people mover cannot be on the table (because he had underground in mind and yes it will be complicated and expensive.

Though he can entertain the people mover (which basically are monorails) along side the airside and the aerodrome complex parameter a little below the height of the NAIAX

It is feasible given that all structures by andrews (air philippines all the way to T4 and genva along domestic road - to T2 and eventually to T3

It can be quite a loop but the sanity of transfer will still feel sane and seamless for passengers

[Arianespace]

Monorail like Hong Kong was never in the table to begin with. While HKG has both monorail and walkalators, MNL would only have the latter

[Gustavo J Oppenheimer]

Will Bulacan have both though if they don't push Monorail to NAIA

[Arianespace]

No. It will have train access though, MRT7 and MRT2 as well as Airport Express