Manila International Airport

[B77Wflyer]

Arianespace wrote

While Terminal 1 and 3 have E-gates, Terminal 2 doesn't have one. That could show the administration's drive to want Centennial be domestic. That perhaps signal the cancellation of multiple fingered PBBs at the North Wing.

I wonder Once T2 will become the new domestic Terminal will there be plans to expand it to accommodate not just PR,  2P, 5J. But also Z2, M8, T6 and DG. which are currently using the old domestic Terminal. Also any update with regards to  PAL Multi-level Mabuhay Lounge at T2? Have they instead focus on opening a larger lounge at either T1 or T3?

[Arianespace]

That should be the plan. But right now its only PAL and CEB as it cannot absorb all domestic. Presently, they already have problems housing both airlines under one roof. Add to that, MIAA's legal woes on PAL lounge at T2 and what to have of it considering it was already partially built. Monreal got a legal roadblock ahead of its plan.The consortium proposal should address T2 extension. DOTr already changed the plan of the previous admin so all bets are off with regards T2.

[B77Wflyer]

Looks liked PAL is starting to moved international flights from T2 to T1.

Effective on July 31, 2018. Flights to Vancouver, Toronto and New York. Will depart and arrived at T1. Afterwords I expect flights to Los Angeles and San Francisco to be moved to T1 from T2 since they already used T1 for arrival.  

https://www.philippineairlines.com/en/about%20us/newsandevents/canada-new-terminal

[B77Wflyer]

Looks liked NAIA "Rationalization Plan" has just been hold?


http://www.flightsinasia.com/article/4134

[Arianespace]

OPS is already out. NAIA Consortium assumes they gonna bag the project with massive publicity stunts. Mind conditioning perhaps. Meanwhile, its competitor GMR is waiting like a hawk to get hold its proposal and outbid them. Two other prospective bidders is also waiting silently for the challenge, one Singaporean the other South Korean.

This is going to be interesting as GMR is bent on winning this contract. Take notice that GMR has well known mileage in airport operations, processing more than 100 million passengers per annum at its belt, while the other contenders also has their owned managed airports just known as operating one of the worlds best.

[Solblanc]

Let's just hope that whoever ends up winning the concession doesn't have to fight off cases left and right. We don't want another PIATCO scandal.

[Arianespace]

Hope springs eternal. I hope too they will revise their earlier projections and increase their propose bid or else they will get swallowed by other tenders.

[frequentflier]

I thought we have ILS on both sides of the main runway?

[Solblanc]

On the Xiamen Air incident...

We're hearing a lot of complaints of passengers being stranded. I'm curious about the following:

1) PAL flights that got diverted to CEB and DVO have stranded passengers there. Was PAL not able to accommodate these passengers on narrowbody domestic flights to MNL? Or at least send some narrowbodies to ferry them home?

2) I remember reading somewhere that widebodies could theoretically take off from runway 13/31. Can't the so-called stranded widebodies take off with a little fuel, and stop to refuel in CRK or CEB or something?

Over 24 hours without a main runway hurts operations a lot. PAL is practically paralyzed.

[seven13]

Definitely not on #1. You have booked passengers on that flights as well. Normally CEB and DVO flights are full.

Second, slotting. Not only PR operates small aircraft. You have Z2 and 5J. If you check FR24, even scheduled small body flights cannot depart on time ustilizing 13/31

That’s theoretical. The risk is so high to try. Definitely no one would want to try it, risking assets and people’s lives. Remember airlines operate on safety first, more like precaution and prevention of accidents.

[tigz]

PAL have an edge on international connecting passengers at T2, you just transfer within the two buildings. Busing out with your bags and boxes from T1 to T2 can be a pain. I thought T1 have run out of gates and the old terminal is not as seamless, why the transfer?

[Arianespace]

NAIA is capable of supporting 10% traffic surge. What happened Saturday was a flash flood of flights.

What MIAA could have done is suspend all domestic and allow only heavies. Not done. Management failure. Glad they took advise and suspended some the next day. Still, Should have been done earlier.

Recovery flight should be done with a bigger aircraft. MAS, CRK, CES, CSN,EVA and two other airlines headed the call, while the rest just sent the missing flights for two days. Result, deluge.

Then there was the problem of limited ground services. Not enough ground to service arriving aircraft which resulted in them sitting in the bay or remote more than designated time. Result, the next batch of arriving planes sat on the runway and taxiway unserviced for couple of hours. And then the next set of arriving flights came along adding to the cue.

Should have hired additional emergency ground personnel but its easier said than done. You cant get competent people for that short period of time. Ground can only support a number of flight. When they are confronted with more than what they can do they grind to a halt. Even LHR and JFK has this problems. And they are much worse believe me.

Good thing we don't have snow. At least planes can land but you have to wait for ground services still. Remember, You are not a passenger yet until airline check you in and thus be entitled to hotel accommodation. If your ticket happens to be from MNL you don't get a hotel. That's why you have sights like these.



I think its about time to change our laws to the standards of the EU.

[tigz]

My issue, and perhaps the rest of us here is have they not established measures based on incidents from the past? There is very little traffic in Subic, perhaps the authority can stage a mock emergency there. They would need also a shortlist of heavy equipment contractors who can deliver salvage operations.

[frequentflier]

I believe the reason they hard time removing the aircraft was because it was raining so hard and the ground was so soft. Thay had a hard time positioning the crane.

[Arianespace]

Not one airline is heading Subic or Clark. All are destined for MNL. Subic has no ground facility. Its just an airport. Clark doesn't have capability to service huge influx of widebody jets. Diversions are mostly refueling stops and CRK got 16 heavies. You are inviting lawsuits for a Clark terminator flight for a contracted MNL flight. The reason why PAL headed to Bangkok, Hongkong, Hanoi, Cebu, Davao, Clark and others for flight diversions was to ground the plane and book passengers in a hotel. Its cheaper that way than burning aviation fuel. But perhaps nobody understood it why it isn't so. Of course, you can waive that right by heading to MNL by bus or for accepting airline concessions like 5,000 miles credit or free roundtrip fare.

First attempt



Second attempt



Third attempt



Salvage operations failed twice due to soft grounds brought by intermittent downpour and thunderstorm warnings. Normal retrieval on a fine day just take 4 hours as long as the aircraft is in stable surface. It was not an ordinary retrieval. The crane was the third option after they failed to reinstall the gears. Had it been heavy, the runway could be closed for a week.

Ground contractors i.e terminal 1 PAGS, work for a number of aircraft for a given day. Their handling equipment depends upon the flight they service for a day. And so does their personnel. It does not provide for 61 additional planes. While 5 to 10 is manageable, 50 more plane is too much and bulk of that is handled in T1 where majority of the heavies dock. These companies does not employ more than what is sufficiently required for their daily operations.  Its just common sense.

By the way, AIIB partial reports disclosed left landing gear hitting on runway edge lights right after landing, causing its eventual collapse followed by engine detachment. No wind gust report so far. Pilot is Korean with 56,000 flight hours. Investigation continues.

[tigz]

Which means the aircraft had an unstable touchdown and veered to the edge right away?, im just curious at what distance from the threshold did it make ground contact? I think the worst incident in this runway was that BAC-111 that overshot and swept some vehicles at the expressway!

[Arianespace]

We do have this as suspect



But for now the AIIB Partial Report


add

[tigz]

Interesting; seems the touchdown is well within limits since NAIA is more than 3000m, but how the aircraft aligned at flare out is one, if the wind hit the pavement strong and rebounded causing the AC to drift, that could have done it; no mention on the type of approach - VFR or ILS?; reminder of the Cebpac Davao incident and there was a mention that the pilot got disoriented with the centreline vs edge lights in pouring rain.

[Arianespace]

tigz wrote

My issue, and perhaps the rest of us here is have they not established measures based on incidents from the past? There is very little traffic in Subic, perhaps the authority can stage a mock emergency there. They would need also a shortlist of heavy equipment contractors who can deliver salvage operations.

Funny how the Senate asked the very same question yesterday.

[B77Wflyer]

According to state news agency PTV. Terminal 2 will start to under go rehabilitation next week.

https://ptvnews.ph/naia-terminal-2-rehab-starts-next-week/