Airlines in the Philippines

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Dipolog Airport

Arianespace
Administrator
This post was updated on .
The apron should be done before its ready for use. See if the apron lights are already installed at the expanded area otherwise certification will have to wait. Apron light is necessary for night operations of civil aviation, although  I remember the old terminal to have floodlights for night traffic but was clearly inadequate , more like being used for twilight departure, as often done by Cebu Pacific. I remember one occasion CEB leaving at 6:30 pm while I was there at the boulevard strolling with friends. It doesn't need to have an ILS to be night rated. It however need this light for aircraft and passenger servicing.

Remember NAIA did not have a working ILS before and aircraft continued landing. It also happens to Cebu for a time. During bad weather we just see the aircraft touch and go around if they don't see the runway lights at least two miles. ILS is there for all weather operations.

By the way, light towers as shown in Roxas Airport is similar to all airports they were installed. If you also observed at SCC  they are designed alike. Personally, I don't think they are bright enough though.

 
image courtesy of DynamicRoxas
Making Sense
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Dipolog Airport

Arianespace
Administrator
While were here, this put a smile on my face. I wonder where the international harvester went?


Image courtesy of Tok_moll

The yellow one is actually better, bigger, and stronger, and more expensive. The red one is just new. Ask the diehard ARFF crew why its better
Making Sense
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Re: Dipolog Airport

dashalvin
This post was updated on .
Light towers are not yet installed but I saw square shape bulbs attached at the top portion of the terminal wall and on the ground beside the taxiway. So Roxas has an ILS now or it uses the field lightings for night landings and take-offs?
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Re: Dipolog Airport

Tigz
Back then late 70s Bacolod, Ilo-ilo operates at night taking in BAC-111s and so does Zamboanga. No ILS that time. Dipolog can operate at night easily without it. Its an instrument approach aid for guidance to the runway in low vis and pilots can operate VFR at night if airport vicinity is not terrain restricted. I see the need for ILS on airports working 24\7 or up to midnight, in essence high traffic. ICAO doesn't say ILS is mandatory for airports to be night rated least a lot worldwide doesn't function after sunset, could you imagine?
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Dipolog Airport

Arianespace
Administrator
In reply to this post by dashalvin
I was just told the light towers were not yet installed in DPL so no night rating yet for this airport. The reason cited to me was that the apron expansion was not yet done. So rating for this airport should come out next year.

Roxas, Dumaguete, Caticlan and Legaspi doesn't have ILS yet. Runway lights doesn't make airport night rated. Its the terminal facility that makes one. Runway lights has been there a long time ago but it didn't make this airport night rated.

As pointed out by Tigs, you also don't need ILS for night rating. It becomes a necessity for 24/7 airport, but even our 24/7 NAIA airport at one time did not have operating ILS. See the logic?
Making Sense
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Re: A330 Refurbishment

Eurest
In reply to this post by romantic_guy08
CAPA now mentions late 2017 for the refurbishment of the 404 seaters into 309 pax A330
But with the 172 seat A321NEOLRs also coming 4Q 2017, does GT Holdings have the financial appetite for such capital expenditures. Or are the A330 refurbishments hinging upon PR finding the much elusive investor?

Aside from SYD & HNL and perhaps JPN flights, where would PR use the 309 seaters?
MEL will probably go daily with a A321NEOLR from current 3x A343?
BNE is doing well for PR but do they envision LF to require an A330 soon?

With current flights, PR would only need 2-4 frames of the 309 seater mainly to replace the A343 on short to medium haul missions
I doubt PR would spend money to refurbish to start new routes w/ 309pax A333, as that does not sync with their cautious expansion over the last few years
I guess there's really no business case to refurbish the monoclass A330s ATM and they're doing fine for charters
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Re: Dipolog Airport

dashalvin
In reply to this post by Arianespace
Thank you for the wonderful info ariane. With the government investing on ILS installation to most class 1 airports, this is a bigger move to a vision of becoming a developed country. BTW, I'm quite impressed how Roxas airport manage to add 1 daily frequency from Manila. Is this growth mostly attributed to tourism or brought by their commercialization?
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LHR slots

seven13
Has anybody read the part 2 of PAL CAPA report?

It states that PAL was able to secure early morning arrival flights in LHR and an early morning arrival back in MNL

[PAL was eventually able to secure morning slots at Heathrow, enabling it in 2015 to switch to its current schedule with a late evening departure from Manila to London. The return flight lands back in Manila in the early morning. PAL upgraded the Manila-London route to daily in mid-2016.]

Were they able to get the much coveted slots at Heathrow? If I remember correctly, Arianespace did explain how PR got the additional slots but on its current time slot.
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Re: A330 Refurbishment

Evodesire
In reply to this post by Eurest
Who are aware of what the new seats of the PAL A330s would be? Will they be J, Y+ and Y?
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A330 Refurbishment

Arianespace
Administrator
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Eurest
Eurest wrote
CAPA now mentions late 2017 for the refurbishment of the 404 seaters into 309 pax A330
But with the 172 seat A321NEOLRs also coming 4Q 2017, does GT Holdings have the financial appetite for such capital expenditures. Or are the A330 refurbishments hinging upon PR finding the much elusive investor?

Aside from SYD & HNL and perhaps JPN flights, where would PR use the 309 seaters?
MEL will probably go daily with a A321NEOLR from current 3x A343?
BNE is doing well for PR but do they envision LF to require an A330 soon?

With current flights, PR would only need 2-4 frames of the 309 seater mainly to replace the A343 on short to medium haul missions

I doubt PR would spend money to refurbish to start new routes w/ 309pax A333, as that does not sync with their cautious expansion over the last few years

I guess there's really no business case to refurbish the monoclass A330s ATM and they're doing fine for charters
At 3 consecutive year profit-taking, PR is in better financial health to finance new capital expenditures. They just secured deals with the A350, entered LOI's with Bombardier for new Q400's, and lately confirmed refurbishment of all monoclass A330's.  Although I'm still skeptical on the last one considering that they only need two to cover some present points, i.e. SYD, NRT, HND,ICN, HNL,HKG,KIX,NGO, and AKL in the future.

Before what I heard was merely conversion of some (2 frames), but now JJB is confident on the conversion of all bunch as he said in November 20 on account of strategy shift (5 star service) to be headed by Paul John Shenton. Truly they are serious with these aims.

If it helps, Lucio Tan also completed settling his debt with Henry Sy in buying SMC out of his airline in 2014.That speaks well about their financial position.

I'm lost however as to their middle east strategy. Rumors have it that they will transfer operations to 2P. As proof of that rumor they are consolidating corporate structure of the low cost subsidiary to support some of the A330 operations. Meaning, flight operations to the gulf, particularly UAE is to be shouldered by GAP. Which make sense if we consider the latest pronouncement of JJB about its ending alliance with EY and the recent airline consolidation. Note also that 2P has flight entitlements in the UAE. GAP flew before to DXB. That are 3 checks already. I'm not sure however if they have rights in other gulf States, which gives me the puzzle.

And if current operations is to be understood, GAP already operates tri-class services in CEB, DVO, ILO, BCD, CGY, TAG, KLO,TAC, LAO and ZAM, aside from the regular monoclass service to all other domestic points. They are also flying SPN now and all international charters.

So like my predictions earlier, PAL is more like heading the way of CX with A321NEOs reputed to have IFEs as its smallest plane, while its low cost subsidiary takes some A330s,A321s, A320s and Q400s. From my sight, their product differentiation is already clear.

The current bi-class A330s might be heading to the middle east if that should be the case.

seven13 wrote
Has anybody read the part 2 of PAL CAPA report?

It states that PAL was able to secure early morning arrival flights in LHR and an early morning arrival back in MNL

[PAL was eventually able to secure morning slots at Heathrow, enabling it in 2015 to switch to its current schedule with a late evening departure from Manila to London. The return flight lands back in Manila in the early morning. PAL upgraded the Manila-London route to daily in mid-2016.]

Were they able to get the much coveted slots at Heathrow? If I remember correctly, Arianespace did explain how PR got the additional slots but on its current time slot.
You must understand that a pair of evening departure slots at LHR are more expensive than morning slots and it was not available that time were it not for RSA to acquire slots of other airlines. Thus, selling this pairs in exchange for the morning slot should result in short term profit but losses in the long run. Survey showed UK passengers prefers night flight and afternoon arrivals in Asia. Try looking at LHRs evening departure to Asia Pacific.

CAPA also said PAL is heading to Chengdu when they already flew there before. As a matter of fact, the airline flew to Chengdu in 2008, and to some other chinese cities like Chongqing. What was left of the 2008 expansion is its flight to Macau. So its not a new destination. I would like to think that old age has finally caught up with JJB because he was PAL president that time. Or maybe error of his assistant who doesn't bother to check historical records.

Making Sense
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BBD Order

Eurest
The BBD Order for Q400NGs has been finalized

A firm 5 valued at 165M$ (caveat, that is the "announced valuation"  actual price was way lower than even ATR's offer as BBD needs cash inflow after GTF fuckup leading to delayed CS100 deliveries which led to add'l job cuts), with 7 as options for an additional 236M$
All 5 will be delivered next year, in 2 class 86 seat config officially as launch customer for the new type

With PAL expanding CRK and CEB, I would be confident those add'l 7 will be exercised

Anyone know their specific mission routing?

I hear they will probably start in MNL but will spend most of the day zipping around the Visayas and perhaps even Mindanao before going back to MNL late in the day

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Re: BBD Order

Tigz
Hmm, it wasn't in the CP24 news this morning but I guess its hardly any news since BBD already previously posted it on media. What a relief for the guys at Downsview. Anyhows, I can see PAL bringing back their old glory days from Cebu to Pagadian, Ozamiz. Dipolog, Surigao, Cotabato,Gen San and even Tandag and Bislig. PAL had these routes way back then - dubbed as the "missionary" routes.
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Re: BBD Order

oninBadz
Malabang, Iligan and Allah Valley were part of those missionary routes I believe but I think this 3 airports ar now defunct.
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Re: BBD Order

Tigz
Those 3 airports didn't prosper, iligan lasted up to the Sunriser generation, ironically PAL suffered loss of lives and aircraft in the vicinity of Iligan as the Shorts flew into terrain obscured by clouds. Malabang and Allah Valley saw the HS-748 last.
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BBD Order

Arianespace
Administrator
In reply to this post by Eurest
Except for Caticlan which is heading the A320 way, GAP should fly these birds to  present destinations it already served with a caveat, that's all there is to it.

If anyone notices, since GAP started operating jets to MPH it loses operational usage of two Bombardier fleet frames. And the worst part they could not used it to open new domestic points out of MNL. They don't have landing slots.

If you compare the utilization rates of both CEB and ATX, GAP has dismal performance with more than half of its frames idly on the ground. Its a good thing that they have low lease rates of this old frames from Nordic Aviation aside from the ones they owned already. But with new frames and high lease rates coming, they would be obliged to fly a single frame at least 5 times a day. And based on their current route, I could see only three frames working for this routes, except that most of the slots are available in the morning requiring the airline to field 8 of them in one window. And that is where the challenge lies.

Unlike CEB which is now truly crisscrossing the countryside, the erstwhile missionary routes, GAP is basically catching up and I don't see them winning some routes they have abandoned before because of poor sales and now was taken a beating by its rivals. If they failed with a lower overhead cost, (ie least rates), why would they succeed now with brand new frames?

Classic example was its battle for Zamboanga hub supremacy. Before, ATR and Q400 crosses the islands of Jolo, Tawi-Tawi, Cebu and Davao from Zamboanga. Then the Q400 left and CEB now operates A320 for this routes, except well Jolo. PAL tried to correct these errors by sending the A320 to Cebu and Davao to dismal results. CEB meanwhile has grown this route. If you look at CEB timetable to Tawi-Tawi, it has grown from thrice a week ATR services to 10x weekly on A320. Mind you its not ATR but Airbus flights. Likewise, GAP market to Cebu was basically eaten by CEB flying almost twice daily from ZAM. Another market lost for them from CEB is PPS (now almost 3xD) DPL, OZC, and PAG, as well as CGY to DVO route which was originally GAP route via B732.

Lately, it also losses VRC from MNL and Tablas might soon disappear. All of them Q400 routes.

So my prognosis is not quite good about the next seven frames. It will never come from the present circumstances they have. But I like the enthusiasm. For all we know the airline might have a radical thinking to make this order worthwhile.
Making Sense
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Re: BBD Order

romantic_guy08
CEB is about to launch Tablas and Masbate, so if GAP retreats, they will be slaughtered there again.

GAP is about to launch three routes from CRK, which aircraft are they going to use here?
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Re: A330 Refurbishment

Evodesire
In reply to this post by Arianespace
Well in fairness to FOD armchair CEO, all his "if it were me..." stuff is now happening to PAL. Seatback IFEs across the board, full service. Still no first class and A380s 😂.

Going back, this is what's puzzling me now. How does Skytrax rate the extra stars? Is it by the airline brand or the operating company. What I understand is PAL international is operated by Philippine Airlines Inc. and PAL domestic, otherwise known as PAL Express, is operated by Air Philippines Corp. Both share the exact livery branding, booking facility, and same cabin crew uniform, sans, the wings nameplates. What I understand too is that to be a 5-star carrier, one has to operate full service all the way.

Question now is how will GAP operate because of this move and new direction of JJB? It is clear that PAL intl will spend to refurbish interiors, acquire nee aircraft, and improve ground to inflight services. What's not clear is GAP. Will they have somewhat of a rebranding like similar to that of Cathay Pacific and Cathay Dragon wherein GAP wont enter the LCC category like 5J but maintain a position as a "semi-low cost"?

With this and the analysis that GAP may operate ME routes, does this mean that they will need to maintain a few high-density 330s? I did read that JJB is refurbishing the A330s bringing back the 2-4-2 layout with seatback IFEs across the board.



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BBD Order

Arianespace
Administrator
In reply to this post by romantic_guy08
romantic_guy08 wrote
CEB is about to launch Tablas and Masbate, so if GAP retreats, they will be slaughtered there again.

GAP is about to launch three routes from CRK, which aircraft are they going to use here?
That would be A320 and Q400.

If I may add to my earlier post, PAL actually lost the use of at least four frames, both Q4s and A320's when Ed Monreal clip their flights for operating without T3 slots, just 29 flights, thus some of them just sat on the ground at Clark.

PAL Clark expansion tomorrow does not even cover half that was lost, even if you put the March 2017 timetable.

And JJB just confirmed to the broadsheet what I just said in this forum prior
“I think 2017 will be more challenging especially for PAL because we have taken delivery of seven airplanes this year. We have to look for more destinations,” PAL president and chief operating officer Jaime Bautista said.

“We have to mount more flights for us to be able to maximize utilization of these airplanes and the question is, will we be able to get more slots here in Manila,” he said.

“Because admittedly, the market we serve are mostly from Manila and if we will not be able to get those slots that we have applied... we will be reducing capacity,” he added.

Bautista said this was the reason why PAL was looking for new hubs.
http://thestandard.com.ph/business/223991/pal-sees-challenging-year-in-2017-bautista.html
I can't understand why 5J operating ATR has grown missionary routes and 2P using Q3'/4s failed. And yet they are seeking profitable routes to field the 5 Q400s.
Making Sense
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A330 Refurbishment

Arianespace
Administrator
In reply to this post by Evodesire
I just said following the CX direction, so that includes the Dragon. But rating will still be just with CX, and so does PR with regards to 2P.
Making Sense
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GAP Flying to HNL

Evodesire
Saw in a post that PAL Express is flying to HNL and its inaugural flight is today. Anyone aware of this or could shed some light?
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