Airlines In The Philippines IV

[Arianespace]

DAL and ANZ

[seven13]

filipinoavgeek wrote

With the year coming to an end, have you heard any rumors about airlines planning to launch MNL flights next year? DL keeps being rumored, and there were recent rumors that they were launching MNL/SIN "imminently", but for whatever reason that has yet to happen. With AF and Zipair pulling out soon, it would be good to have new airlines to replace them. NAIA slots aren't easy to get after all.

With AF pulling out or rather, MNL is a seasonal route, KLM could revert to flying daily again.

[seven13]

Arianespace wrote

DAL and ANZ

Since DAL is imminent, is this the reason why PR is launching a third rotation to LAX or it's just a coincidence, same with ANZ? You also mentioned that PR is to restart AKL service once more A35K goes online since PR needs to find routes for the 777s.

[Arianespace]

PAL really did intend to restore its flight services to LAX and SFO before covid followed by CEB-LAX. For SFO, it was beaten to the punch by UAL last October. It move early for LAX so it wont be beated by DAL. Most likely they would still pursue the restoration plan next year for additional SFO and CEB, considering 5 35ks would go online next year and EU is still closed due to geopolitics.

[ewh1]

On a.net, someone mentioned that PR got ORD slots for S26, so there's a possibility that it may be one of the new US routes next year. Definitely entering AA & UA territory now.

I know this is a broken record but hope PR joins Oneworld or something in the next couple years, especially with the influx of NA capacity and routes coming online, I think they'd be more useful now as a partner and would be nice to be able to use alliance benefits with them.

[filipinoavgeek]

Wouldn't the 777 be way too much capacity for AKL? Even the A330 might arguably be overkill. It would have been nice for PR to get at least some A321XLRs, especially since 5J canceled their orders and I think the XLR would be a good fit for PR given their more premium focus.

ewh1 wrote

On a.net, someone mentioned that PR got ORD slots for S26, so there's a possibility that it may be one of the new US routes next year. Definitely entering AA & UA territory now.

I know this is a broken record but hope PR joins Oneworld or something in the next couple years, especially with the influx of NA capacity and routes coming online, I think they'd be more useful now as a partner and would be nice to be able to use alliance benefits with them.

Honestly it's kinda weird that Fiji Airways is in Oneworld and PR isn't considering it's a far smaller airline with a more niche operation. I know that Southeast Asia already has MH, and there's already CX and JL in Asia, but PR could still have a niche somewhere. It's not like airlines can't co-exist in an alliance: see TG and SQ, or GA and VN.

[seven13]

filipinoavgeek wrote

Wouldn't the 777 be way too much capacity for AKL? Even the A330 might arguably be overkill. It would have been nice for PR to get at least some A321XLRs, especially since 5J canceled their orders and I think the XLR would be a good fit for PR given their more premium focus.

I was thinking the freed up 359 from JFK can do HNL/SYD runs freeing up A333 triclass which can be deployed to AKL maybe a 3x a week service again. PR can do a cooperation service with ANZ, both codesharing on each other’s flights.

PR could also technically field their B777 to DXB and DOH. DXB profile is a mix of leisure and ofws while DOH gets the overflow from QR, so a presentable product is a must.

[Solblanc]

Alliance membership has many benefits, yes, but it also has costs, and most of PAL’s historical management just weren’t prepared to shoulder those costs. They have to reserve award space for partner airlines. They have to increase lounge capacity to accommodate the elite flyers. And they also have to adopt the alliance’s standard booking system.

Look at EK or EY. They just go it alone. It’s not worth it to them. They just do bespoke partnerships.

Anyway, Richard has oneworld experience. Perhaps he’ll steer PAL in that direction eventually.

[Arianespace]

Well, this forum has not been short of telling all the while that ORD is their next gateway after SEA. That is no secret either. Its really just a question of when as the last time they plan to do it was in 2019 with A359.

ewh1 wrote

On a.net, someone mentioned that PR got ORD slots for S26, so there's a possibility that it may be one of the new US routes next year. Definitely entering AA & UA territory now.

[Arianespace]

filipinoavgeek wrote

Wouldn't the 777 be way too much capacity for AKL? Even the A330 might arguably be overkill.

Yes it does. But not for the 300 seater A333. 77w was however the gauge for seat restricted SYD. So it would be deployed there soon, with the displaced 333 going there.in AKL

[Arianespace]

seven13 wrote

I was thinking the freed up 359 from JFK can do HNL/SYD runs freeing up A333 triclass which can be deployed to AKL maybe a 3x a week service again. PR can do a cooperation service with ANZ, both codesharing on each other’s flights.

PR could also technically field their B777 to DXB and DOH. DXB profile is a mix of leisure and ofws while DOH gets the overflow from QR, so a presentable product is a must.

That is overkill as the a330 has almost the same capacity as the 359, but could work as capacity upgrade. I don't think however they are there already as PAL never manages to do the sector daily. 77w could work in DOH and DXB as these were the destinations identified they go to when the 35k arrives. Which, as stated earlier is an upgrade since it can be filled to the brim without weight restrictions.

[Arianespace]

This is correct. Heard it from JJB himself.

[seven13]

Arianespace wrote

Well, this forum has not been short of telling all the while that ORD is their next gateway after SEA. That is no secret either. Its really just a question of when as the last time they plan to do it was in 2019 with A359.

ewh1 wrote

On a.net, someone mentioned that PR got ORD slots for S26, so there's a possibility that it may be one of the new US routes next year. Definitely entering AA & UA territory now.

ahhh there goes the answer for the freed up A359.

[seven13]

Arianespace wrote

seven13 wrote

I was thinking the freed up 359 from JFK can do HNL/SYD runs freeing up A333 triclass which can be deployed to AKL maybe a 3x a week service again. PR can do a cooperation service with ANZ, both codesharing on each other’s flights.

PR could also technically field their B777 to DXB and DOH. DXB profile is a mix of leisure and ofws while DOH gets the overflow from QR, so a presentable product is a must.

That is overkill as the a330 has almost the same capacity as the 359, but could work as capacity upgrade. I don't think however they are there already as PAL never manages to do the sector daily. 77w could work in DOH and DXB as these were the destinations identified they go to when the 35k arrives. Which, as stated earlier is an upgrade since it can be filled to the brim without weight restrictions.

Before covid, PR flew to AKL with the triclass (309seater) after its upgrade from the A320. Could PR do a tag-on from SYD instead using the B777? Seems an overkill too. Maybe they can copy CI? or maybe a tag on from BNE or MEL?

[Arianespace]

seven13 wrote

 Could PR do a tag-on from SYD instead using the B777? Seems an overkill too. Maybe they can copy CI? or maybe a tag on from BNE or MEL?

Yes they could. But what is the point of the tag when PAL could fill almost all of the seats at SYD? Doesn't really make a lot of sense. Tag works only on very thin sectors, to make the route more viable. BNE is doing fine by itself now. So what could possibly work is AKL via DRW with the A321neo, which by the way they have plenty arriving next year. While PAL could not carry pax between AKL and DRW, they could carry both pax for MNL, which by the way makes a lot of sense than fielding an XLR or A330.

[seven13]

Arianespace wrote

seven13 wrote

 Could PR do a tag-on from SYD instead using the B777? Seems an overkill too. Maybe they can copy CI? or maybe a tag on from BNE or MEL?

Yes they could. But what is the point of the tag when PAL could fill almost all of the seats at SYD? Doesn't really make a lot of sense. Tag works only on very thin sectors, to make the route more viable. BNE is doing fine by itself now. So what could possibly work is AKL via DRW with the A321neo, which by the way they have plenty arriving next year. While PAL could not carry pax between AKL and DRW, they could carry both pax for MNL, which by the way makes a lot of sense than fielding an XLR or A330.

Maybe a tag on from PER alternatively, so that we could see PER going to 6x a week or daily with half goes to AKL?

So when the ACFs arrives, it’ll free up the A21Ns more. Hopefully PR can reinstate CTS to year-round service. Btw, do you have an idea how many ACF frames will arrive in 2026? Hoping that 9937 and 9932 returns to service next year.

MH is planning to serve CEB

[JNC03]

LH is not yet coming to Manila?

Oh I wonder if LTP and NNIC reached an agreement already

[filipinoavgeek]

seven13 wrote

Maybe a tag on from PER alternatively, so that we could see PER going to 6x a week or daily with half goes to AKL?

I don't think AKL needs a tag anymore. The PH-NZ market is large enough that it could sustain even a few weekly nonstop flights now, especially with the growing Filipino population there. MNL-CNS-AKL made sense when the market was still new, but it's long past that now. The fact that ANZ is planning to try again (after planning but ultimately not launching last time) speaks to that. PER is also stable enough now that it probably doesn't need tags either.

seven13 wrote

MH is planning to serve CEB

Considering that there are rumors of MH phasing out the Firefly brand over the next few years due to financial and operational issues (Firefly has been loss-making for years), maybe they are already getting ahead of the curve and moving the flight to mainline.

[Arianespace]

filipinoavgeek wrote

<
I don't think AKL needs a tag anymore. The PH-NZ market is large enough that it could sustain even a few weekly nonstop flights now, especially with the growing Filipino population there. MNL-CNS-AKL made sense when the market was still new, but it's long past that now. The fact that ANZ is planning to try again (after planning but ultimately not launching last time) speaks to that. PER is also stable enough now that it probably doesn't need tags either.

We are talking about tag possibilities. We do understand that there is huge traffic there, as most of them transit via SYD and the rest via SiN.There is no reason why MNL-CNS-AKL couldn't be brought back either as it it is also within the realms of possibility, if traffic turns out to be thinner than expected for the 333 to make it work. In all honesty, it really boils down to pricing strategy to make them fly direct, or fly with PAL one stop instead of other carriers in SYD and SIN. I'm sure CNS would be restored too. There will be 5 a321neo for delivery in 2026. So there are plenty of routes to try.

[Arianespace]

Gate, yes. Application and slot allocation, not there yet. By the way, NNIC controls the gate, SCL controls the slot, and CAB processes the application for permit to fly.