Airlines In The Philippines III

[Gustavo J Oppenheimer]

5J says they are ready to trim the 152 Airbus orders to 70 if NMIA doesn't happen  




https://aviationweek.com/air-transport/airports-networks/cebu-pacific-ceo-philippines-ripe-lcc-growth-despite-engine-woes

Szucs said the new Bulacan airport, currently under development, could unlock significant expansion. “This is going to give an opportunity for a completely different level of growth,” he said. “It’s essentially like Narita coming online, and you’ve got Haneda.”

[Gustavo J Oppenheimer]

This is a paid article

https://centreforaviation.com/analysis/reports/philippine-airlines-prepares-to-resume-growth-and-plans-next-stages-of-fleet-renewal-727964

[airline_builder]

so allegedly PAL is looking at 20 A330NEOS option beyond 2028

Airbus it is then.

Concentration on North America. No mention of Europe at all.

[xzibit31]

airline_builder wrote

so allegedly PAL is looking at 20 A330NEOS option beyond 2028

Airbus it is then.

Concentration on North America. No mention of Europe at all.

no mention of Boeing?

will they be an all Airbus fleet?

[JNC03]

Order A330neos and refurbish Boeing 77Ws, it is what the plan of PAL all along?

They will just deal with ageing of 77Ws later on

[Darkknight85]

airline_builder wrote

so allegedly PAL is looking at 20 A330NEOS option beyond 2028

Airbus it is then.

Concentration on North America. No mention of Europe at all.

What article?

[JNC03]

After Starlux halted its Manila operations, they will make a comeback according to their post earlier

[seven13]

JNC03 wrote

After Starlux halted its Manila operations, they will make a comeback according to their post earlier

I hope it is good enough to connect to their North Am flights. an early afternoon departure 1300H to 1500H seems ideal.

[seven13]

Darkknight85 wrote

airline_builder wrote

so allegedly PAL is looking at 20 A330NEOS option beyond 2028

Airbus it is then.

Concentration on North America. No mention of Europe at all.

What article?

 Most likely the paid article link from the previous page

[xzibit31]

JNC03 wrote

Order A330neos and refurbish Boeing 77Ws, it is what the plan of PAL all along?

They will just deal with ageing of 77Ws later on

 I was hoping for a mix of 330N's and 789's.

I also think that refurbing the 77w's is the best option for PR now since the 777x's are still in limbo.

[Arianespace]

airline_builder wrote

so allegedly PAL is looking at 20 A330NEOS option beyond 2028

Airbus it is then.

Concentration on North America. No mention of Europe at all.

Hold your horses. That is not cast in stone just yet.

This is how things are going to unbundle in the coming years. 7w refurb still hangs in the air subject to earning forecast for 2025. Next aircraft order shall comprise the narrow-body fleet to replace A320 beginning 2028, most likely the neo, and widebody medium haul for delivery 2030. That sums it up.  This is where the rub is. Nobody ain't telling which one. The 4th generation 253t A330 debuts in 2028. This is what Airbus is selling PAL. Boeing also up the ante with the 2nd generation 789ER which is a different plane than the current version. In 3 years time, Airbus and Boeing would have different planes than they currently have. What defines North American market is payload. It always had been. It will always be.

[romantic_guy08]

Arianespace wrote

airline_builder wrote

so allegedly PAL is looking at 20 A330NEOS option beyond 2028

Airbus it is then.

Concentration on North America. No mention of Europe at all.

Hold your horses. That is not cast in stone just yet.

This is how things are going to unbundle in the coming years. 7w refurb still hangs in the air subject to earning forecast for 2025. Next aircraft order shall comprise the narrow-body fleet to replace A320 beginning 2028, most likely the neo, and widebody medium haul for delivery 2030. That sums it up.  This is where the rub is. Nobody ain't telling which one. The 4th generation 253t A330 debuts in 2028. This is what Airbus is selling PAL. Boeing also up the ante with the 2nd generation 789ER which is a different plane than the current version. In 3 years time, Airbus and Boeing would have different planes than they currently have. What defines North American market is payload. It always had been. It will always be.

any chance PAL is waiting for the launch real world performance of the 777X to gauge if they will order it?

[JNC03]

Will they choose CFM for the A320neos this time?🤔

[airline_builder]

Arianespace wrote

airline_builder wrote

so allegedly PAL is looking at 20 A330NEOS option beyond 2028

Airbus it is then.

Concentration on North America. No mention of Europe at all.

Hold your horses. That is not cast in stone just yet.

This is how things are going to unbundle in the coming years. 7w refurb still hangs in the air subject to earning forecast for 2025. Next aircraft order shall comprise the narrow-body fleet to replace A320 beginning 2028, most likely the neo, and widebody medium haul for delivery 2030. That sums it up.  This is where the rub is. Nobody ain't telling which one. The 4th generation 253t A330 debuts in 2028. This is what Airbus is selling PAL. Boeing also up the ante with the 2nd generation 789ER which is a different plane than the current version. In 3 years time, Airbus and Boeing would have different planes than they currently have. What defines North American market is payload. It always had been. It will always be.

The direction to the A330Neos is baited on the commonality and transition for both flight crew, crew, and maintenance. These factors will save the airlines in the millions. As for the increased 253t feature - under PAL configuration and revenue optimization equation on load factor - it will struggle to fly to intended European routes like London, Paris, Frankfurt, the same applies to mainland USA.

In connection to the Boeing 787-9 ER enhanced capabilities - nowhere in the Boeing journals or casual pronouncements that it was and will ever be in the pipeline. There were talks before for the Boeing 787-10 but never happened.

[airline_builder]

A330-900: The newest, lowest seat mile cost mid size widebody  
● Based on the A330-300, which is part of the most operated widebody family ever  
● Consolidates A330 family position in the 300-seater category.  
● Designed to replace A330-300, A340-300 and B777-200/ER  
● 7,200nm / 13 334 km of range for the latest variant 251 t, 1,500nm / 2 780 km more range vs
today’s A330-300 (ceo operations range average)

AIRBUS BROCHURE

[Arianespace]

romantic_guy08 wrote

any chance PAL is waiting for the launch real world performance of the 777X to gauge if they will order it?

The long haul battle has been won by Airbus.
The medium haul is still being fought.

airline_builder wrote

In connection to the Boeing 787-9 ER enhanced capabilities - nowhere in the Boeing journals or casual pronouncements that it was and will ever be in the pipeline. There were talks before for the Boeing 787-10 but never happened.

It was announced in 2021 at the height of the pandemic by no less than Stan Deal. If you take a closer look, the B789 produced after 2021 are actually second generation planes, after first generation aircraft were subjected to series of retrofits. If you can't see any announcement now is  because of Boeing priority over the 77x official launch to service. But it doesn't mean that improvement plans never existed, as they already did the retrofits. If Leeham calculations are accurate, that should give them more than enough payload boost for North American flights, at the configuration they desired. Boeing does series of PEPs on their aircraft that never went to press with newer 77w operating much better than its predecessor decades ago, yet they are still called 77w. In fact, PAL 77w also got PEPs when they went to D checks to make them a better and efficient plane.

JNC03 wrote

Will they choose CFM for the A320neos this time?🤔

I think they would still be P&W

[Gustavo J Oppenheimer]

5J has confirmed dropping their initial order of 10 A321 XLRs according to this Bloomberg article (via BusinessMirror)

Reason is due to delays, weight limitations and specification changes

https://businessmirror.com.ph/2025/10/02/airbus-budget-customers-feel-buyers-remorse-over-xlr-jet/

[Arianespace]

We know XLR doesn't have the range to fly down under missions with dense configuration. Simple physics. XLR would however work wonders for PR but not for 5J. PAL is content with the LR for PER. XLR are meant for low density configuration, not cattle classes. CEB wanted to fly as far as PER but found it is a lot harder to reach than it seems and very different from what they are used to packing in passengers. XLR is a very good long haul aircraft for 180 seats. It's not going to work well with a 240 seats cabin. There is reason why Airbus promotions configures the seating that way. Range. Its the "R" of the XLR. This is where airlines chooses, payload or range. That is trading one in favor of another. You simply can't have both beyond the flying envelope.

[oninBadz]

Is the B737 Max 9 out of the table as well? I still prefer PAL having both Airbus and Boeing. Hopefully they would eventually choose the Dreamliner over the NEO.

[Solblanc]

If PAL just needs a medium-haul plane, the 33N is there. No need to splurge on 787s or negotiating with lessors for 787 slots.

If the point is for the medium-haul planes to be able to serve as a stopgap when long-haul planes go tech, like when we see the 333s go to LAX, well, I guess it would be nice to have 787s.

That being said, with 9-12 A35Ks, 2 A359s, and 10 77Ws, do they really need any more long-haul capacity?

In the short-term, they should at the very least make sure that SYD/MEL don’t get a 9-abreast plane. Perhaps a few XLRs might help PR for that.