Airlines In The Philippines II

[JNC03]

Philippine Airlines president Gilbert Santa Maria is stepping down as president and COO of Philippine Airlines
PAL’s board of directors chaired by taipan Lucio Tan is set to meet on Monday, Jan. 31, and part of the agenda will be Santa Maria’s departure.

https://www.onenews.ph/articles/philippine-airlines-president-stepping-down

[Evodesire]

Just sad to see PAL being run like a typical family corporation. Its like after every milestone, a President steps down. After PAL bagged multiple awards from Skytrax in 2019, JJB steps down. After PAL exits C11, GSM steps down.

Replacing GSM is Capt. Stanley Ng, husband of LT's daughter Lilybeth Tan - Ng, who is also a pilot. Well on the brighter side of things, nice though to see the young guns stepping in. I hope they remove those old farts in management. I agree with GSM that PAL can no longer be run as though we are still in the 80s era.

[Arianespace]

Was surprise to learn these things. Accordingly, Sta. Maria tendered his resignation after December 17. He did asked nicely LT to be let go even before the NY court ruled C11 exit for PAL. Apparently to save the company more cash from his services which has been drastically reduced in half. He already achieved what he and the old man wanted. Substantial haircut of debts. US$2 billion at that. Would have been nice if he stayed a little longer. But I guess he had other plans in life.

[Evodesire]

If Im not mistaken, Capt. Ng is OIC while PAL looks for a new President. I just hope that this time, they get people who are experienced in the airline industry with track record.

[Arianespace]

Not to sound repetitive, but the person that makes real decision is the one that puts in the money. I've already told this forum multiple times. It is always the CEO, never the COO that says the final word.

Read this and see the mind of this person, from the point of view of JJB himself.

[Arianespace]

Arianespace wrote

Another surprise which is still in wraps is the net profit reported in the 4Q.

Well, they are officially out

Philippine Airlines, Inc. (PAL) made a profit of $32.97 million (P1.7 billion) in December, four months after filing for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection, reversing a loss of $11.67 million incurred in November.

According to PAL Chief Financial Officer Nilo Thaddeus P. Rodriguez’s end-December report to the United States Bankruptcy Court for the Southern District of New York, the airline had a gross income of $183.82 million for the month, up 28.1% from $143.48 million earned in November.

https://www.bworldonline.com/pal-swings-to-profit-with-p1-7b-in-december/

[JNC03]

Philippine Airlines (PAL) has selected Airbus to perform cabin modification for 15 aircraft and expand the material services programme

https://airlinergs.com/airbus-to-provide-cabin-upgrades-for-philippine-airlines-fleet/

[Eurest]

Does PR need cabin crew union approval for cabin config changes? And if so, are anyone here to spill the beans?

Are they going with a denser 2-2-2 J for the A359, or removing PE, or just removing galleys like the ones on 51 and 65 right?

I'm assuming its removing PE? Since the 309 A333s are going closer with the 363?
Were they just reverting back the 363s that were refitted to 309s by LTP?

I wouldn't be surprised if Airbus didn't make financial concessions for these refit, since its their birds that aren't profitable

So 5 star Skytrax no more?

Will we finally see consolidation among the ASEAN & HK/Taiwan or will nat'l pride prevail?
The makers of Jade an hour away see grey skies ahead, and are looking for a change of scenery so they can finally see a good sunrise

[XWB_flyer]

Some details about PAL planned densification for there fleet below

Flag carrier Philippine Airlines (PAL) will refit seat configuration of 15 of its aircraft covering its Airbus fleet.

The cabin modification will cover 11 A320s, two A330-300s and two A350-900s to be performed by Airbus.

PAL decided to ditch its business class in its A320 as Airbus restores 24 more seats to bring the total seat count to 180 all economy seat, a configuration that suits the airline’s requirements for short-haul inter-island domestic routes.

The airline is expected to return domestic services to Bacolod, Iloilo, Tagbilaran, Tacloban, Puerto Princesa, Cagayan de Oro and Zamboanga, where PAL Express is the previous operator. The rest of the domestic route will be service by PAL Express.

Meanwhile, PAL will refit two of its Airbus A330-300s to accommodate additional 50 seats that will bring the total seat count to 359.

PAL said they need this density for the middle east, as the airline return some of its high density A330s to lessors due to fleet rationalization plan effected in the Bankruptcy proceedings in New York. The airline said these refitted aircraft will also be used for Cebu, Davao, and General Santos flights, as well as to Korea and China.

For the long haul, PAL also decided to ditch some of its business class seats in favor 18 more economy seats for a total of 313 seats.

According to PAL, they will only reduce the business class and still preserves the roomy cabin layout and passenger-friendly experience that PAL Business Class and Economy Class travelers enjoy on the A350’s long-haul routes to London, Toronto and New York.

In another news, PAL is extending its ‘Flight Hour Services’ (FHS) material programme with Airbus to cover more of its fleet from 2 to 39, with guaranteed parts availability to secure the operational reliability and efficiency of PAL’s widebody and narrowbody aircraft.

The FHS programme, which currently covers two A350s, now includes 37 more aircraft, comprising 29 A321 Family (including eight A321neos) and eight A330ceos.

Airbus will provide components standard exchange, components repairs, component reliability and engineering services, as well as on-site stock at PAL’s main base in Manila. The FHS will be performed by Lufthansa Tecknik Philippines.

http://philippineairspace.blogspot.com/2022/02/pal-refits-fleet-to-seat-more-passengers.html

[XWB_flyer]

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[Eurest]

PR customers seem to be value oriented, so a cabin of dense J (2-2- instead of 1-2-1) and Y suits its market better

Prop up 2P more, transfer A320s/A321CEOs and majority of A330s
Have the PR livery but add "Air" before the "Philippines"
Do the Air Japan et al that ANA does, integrating it more closely to 2 lines are blurred

A streamlined A321NEO/CEO,XLR plus 1 long-haul type would be cost effective for PR
Dense-short routes like NRT & HKG can still be covered with widebodies that need the flight hours/cycles balanced
Since most of the ATAs are seat limited and not frequency, the A321s provide flexibility, even more with XLRs
The XLR could even be the new route starter (e.g.)Anchorage

Having just one type widebody would even more cost-effective
Leaving just 2 of the 6 A359s and needing to have them reconfigured speaks volumes

So yes, I'm advocating for a simplified fleet of A321 variants plus A35J or B777-9 for mainline
2P goes A320/321 & A330 (with a few retaining the Premium Flatbed ala AirAsia)
2P doesn't need the new a/c prestige, because it can bank on mainline's rep

[Eurest]

A350 config update, if anyone can verify

Premium Economy becomes Economy plus
3-4 rows of extended legroom 9 abreast Fiesta+ instead of 3
L2-L3 now has 17 rows of seats from 16
Lavatory & Galley rearrangements as well

[Evodesire]

Eurest wrote

Having just one type widebody would even more cost-effective
Leaving just 2 of the 6 A359s and needing to have them reconfigured speaks volumes

So yes, I'm advocating for a simplified fleet of A321 variants plus A35J or B777-9 for mainline
2P goes A320/321 & A330 (with a few retaining the Premium Flatbed ala AirAsia)
2P doesn't need the new a/c prestige, because it can bank on mainline's rep

What if PAL considers a simplified widebody fleet of A350-1000/900 and Boeing 787-10 for medium haul flights. Not only is the 787-10 the A330-900s closest counterpart, but at least PAL still maintain Boeings in the fleet. Then just a fleet of A321NEOs for their narrowbody.

Yey or nay?

[Eurest]

The 254T 787-10 can make 14hr flights at 342 seats for BR (TPE-CDG). So if Boeing can provide a 787-10HGW to PR at 330-342 seats, it would be the most efficient option. It would be massively cheaper to procure & operate as well compared to the 777-9. Slots are possible despite the delivery hiccups.

If PR can get more MNL slots then it can use the popular strategy nowadays of smaller, highly efficient aircraft with more frequency. If not, PR still needs to maximize every slot, thus the need for a bigger aircraft like the 777-9

With the A330-900 now at 7200nm at 300 seats bi-class, then it has a use case for PR as a NA west coast/EU option
Cheaper than an A350 to buy, basically similar to their 278T A350 in capacity & it'll be cheap and slots easier to come by. Since Airbus now has Alabama leverage for US DoT, perhaps PR could go mainly Airbus/BBD

An attractively priced package of A339 and A35JHGW may already be in the future for PR, given how Toulouse seems to value the carriers from the land of Prince Philip of Asturias
But your suggestion of the 787-10HGW & A359/A35J/B777-9 would also make for an efficient fleet.

Leveraging the A339 vs the 787-10HGW should get PR a sweet deal. PR could even offer an all Boeing or Airbus long-haul fleet exclusivity for added leverage.

*edit* Forgot about the HGW 787-10

[Arianespace]

I don't recall PAL considering the B787 in their fleet. Even during the time of Sta. Maria. Could change in leadership make leverage to 10HGW?

Second, they are on record saying that they will take the A339 soon, no brainer since they operated already A333. YVR, SEA and TLV could easily be reached by this type.

Third, there was episode I think 3-4 years ago, that they consider the A35K to be better "suited" for their operation than the B779, economic wise, as they intend to fly multiple frequencies to US, which I believe makes a lot of sense. Prior to covid they went 17x a week to LAX and 12xpw to SFO. Had there been no disruption they could easily be flying 3x/2x daily by this time, juggling the 77w,35k, and 359 to the west coast.


My take on fleet planning perspective, PAL don't need the 10hGW. 339 will take care of all their desired destinations while 359 will take care of the longer ones. They will need the 779 eventually.

[Arianespace]

The way things are at the moment, PH planes still allowed to overfly Russian Airspace. For now LHR, JFK and YYZ overflights is safe. Toronto and New York even grow this summer, while London grow 4x a month. Our government was asked to join sanctions with Russia. Duterte declined. So far, we are in good grace with Russia. Both leaders are good friends.

The problem, PAL pay Russia in US dollars. Their depositary account is not yet frozen but may end up being sanctioned too. They are now negotiating with Chinese banks for backup solutions should things go sour. Just marvel PAL crisscrossing Siberian Airspace nowadays. Its actually good for them.

[Eurest]

MNL-LHR is still listed up to end of the Summer 2022 timetable at LHR
PR swapped 4 LHR slots with KU then a week later swapped 14 slots with BA so PR 720 arrives uniformly at 2305 and 721 departs at 2300 from the previous arrival at 1410 & 1735 and dep at 1555 & 2120
But PR will only use 2? with BA leasing the rest all summer 22?

PR was already set to go all B77W and return all A359s, what did Airbus offer to convince PR to keep 2 A359s?
Despite CoViD, PR preferred to keep the older & bigger capacity B77W. Whereas the others seem to prefer their A350s and returned B77W to lessors or stored them
So a mix of Y capacity and payload range seems to be a priority since as the only route that would not be consistently MTOW limited would be YVR

The A359 seems to be the new flagship of choice once taken by the 747 variants, and later the B77W
Easier to fill and better economics than even the A35K
But it doesn't seem to be enough for PR
Perhaps the new 32J/36Y+/245Y might change that

Although the 787 and A330NEO are plausible, I doubt we'll see them for PR soon
The likeliest B77W replacements if the A359 isn't enough are: (in order of probability)
i) Late production B77W leases - would be really cheap and would have cabin retrofits and the 17hr range
ii) A35k - basically a more fuel efficient B77W but might still be expensive to lease, and might not have slots to buy as the A359 is really gaining popularity
ii) B777-9 - Might be too big for majority of carriers given the new nature of air travel but Boeing might resort to very aggressive pricing to ensure the project doesn't end up like the 748

The reports of the US Embassy in MNL filled for VISA apps til September & CX being in a limbo, might bode well for PR to recover & even gain market share (see QR vs EK during the pandemic)

*edit* removed redundant statement

[Evodesire]

A339 makes sense over the 787-10 especially that PAL has a lot of A330 rated pilots and crew. Now the question is, will PAL exercise those 6 A350 options for the A35K as old 77W replacements?

[Arianespace]

Eurest wrote

PR was already set to go all B77W and return all A359s, what did Airbus offer to convince PR to keep 2 A359s?

This question was actually answered in this forum awhile back. Briefly, it was all about Lucio Tan.

If Sta. Maria had his way he would have wanted only 4 77w retained, two of which is 77 and 76 under sale compulsory leaseback to GECAS and Castlelake.

And then there was Voyager, intent to have their planes flying, granted payment deferrals to PAL, other than offering favorable lease terms.

Avation then gave them the best deal for retaining also their plane. Its all there in the thread posted a year ago. (March 2021 onwards)  Some of the new lease terms are later known to be PBH (Power by the Hour).

Discussions with lessors brought PAL 8 planes (from 4-5-6 boeing and 0-2-3 airbus). Still 8 planes. The airbus deal was explained best by flightglobal. PAL will lease half and surrender the other half. Meaning, PAL will operate only 1 from Avolon, SMBC, and Goshawk. That is what happened to the A350. The most peculiar case however was the fleet from Avolon which all went to Lufthansa Tecknik to be operated by Lufthansa. 3504 happens to be financial lease by PAL if I'm not mistaken. At first only one was approved via LTP ownership but both was eventually taken by LT AG in Hamburg.

Evodesire wrote

A339 makes sense over the 787-10 especially that PAL has a lot of A330 rated pilots and crew. Now the question is, will PAL exercise those 6 A350 options for the A35K as old 77W replacements?

I already answered this question that you repeatedly asked. But to make it current I did asked PAL people about it and it has not answered those since chapter 11 exit.

I would like to believe the option is still there, judging from the deals they have with the undelivered A21Ns last year for delivery in 2028 instead of 2021. Airbus has been very good to them. Its a historical fact.

You could have this answer in five years time as PAL tries to recall their fleet back beginning with the triple seven.

I don't believe that 35k will replace the 77w. I think it would be replace by 779 in the future.

[Eurest]

I apologize for the confusion, I was merely alluding to the industry belief that Toulouse offered a sweetheart deal for the retention of the 2 A359 (1ea from Avolon&SMBC) hoping to present a better case for the airframe's viability for a value-centric carrier.

Judging from SAS & KQA's fleeting options, also Seabury clients, they would have emphasized cost efficiencies. SAS forward looks like A321NEO&A359 & KQ going 737Max & 788, single type for both. Going A320/A330 for 2P and A321/B77W for PR seems the most likely advisory.

LH getting the A359s was their desperation for long-haul widebodies, thus their recent decisions to revive their B744 and A346 fleets despite the oil prices. Too much of a no brainer, fairly similar cabin ambience, premium config, & newerish built. It probably went Zwei A350 mieten Ja? Nimm mein Geld! Goshawk - Okay!
SMBC&Avolon probably had a similar experience for their ones.

The original SMC 2013 planned long-haul fleet was 10 A359 & 10 B779 (4 B77W interim 4 later B779 deliveries)
At that time, the 35K was dismissed as not big enough for NA (except YVR) requirements.
If the post-CoViD projection no longer requires a 400 seater, then the A35K makes sense
Abandoning the 359 seems to indicate abandoning the Europe expansion, especially since its only YVR that won't need a 400 seater. You might be surprised, but the projection then, is that YYZ & JFK would need a 400 seater. But that was 2013 forecasting.

As for the Dreamliner HGW, I asked marketing peeps from Renton and Oh Boy!
They're placing the 787-10ER against the A359, promising more seats, guaranteed lower trip costs and lower seat mile than the A359
The A359 has too much range and not enough capacity for the SFO&LAX
Maybe the future for PR is the Dreamliner ER (HGW B789 also in development)
So ANZ is replacing their 77E with 787-10ERs
And we know the 77E's are capable of EWR-HKG (fairly similar to MNL-JFK) eastward restricted, if the 787-10HGW won, then we can definitely ascertain the 787-10ER will be capable for PR as well.
Flexibility in frequency, with unbeatable trip cost and seat mile. That is the Dreamliner as is now.
Again, the Dreamliner ER, the future for PR long-haul?
10-16 787-10ERs and perhaps 4 789ER, for MNL-JFK/YYZ unrestricted weightwise, perhaps even making MNL-MIA/MCO?

The B773 progressing to the B77W was game-changing, Boeing will probably do it again.
Maybe it's Airbus that's hindering PR and keeping it bankrupt.
Bet on A346 instead of B77W, Went A343 instead of B77E. Went A333HGW instead of Dreamliners.