Airlines In The Philippines IV

[Arianespace]

This is volume IV. We are growing. It took us five years to complete II and just 20 months to fill up volume III. Onwards to  relevant discussions about Airlines in the Philippines.

Firing the salvo, PAL is set to received the first a35k this week. As was stated earlier, PAL made pre-delivery payments equivalent to 2 frames to Airbus. BOC Aviation later announced that it has bought the 2 frames from PAL. Proceeds will go to finance the next 2 frames.

Meanwhile, announcement for the replacement of the A330 was deferred further down the road, possibly in 2027, but there is high probability of its announcement next year due to growing lead times. There is strong indication that orders for the narrowbodies and medium widebodies would be announce simultaneously.

Pending its announcement, lets see if this picture lives up to its word.




PAL also starts to receive new A321neo starting next year. Not the ones intended for GAP. Maybe India is finally on their sight again.



Post away folks!

[Gustavo J Oppenheimer]

Korean Air and it's LCC subsidiaries will offer inflight Starlink service starting next year, full implementation by 2027 across the whole fleet.

Waiting for either PR or 5J

https://koreajoongangdaily.joins.com/news/2025-12-05/business/industry/Korean-Air-4-affiliated-airlines-to-offer-inflight-Starlink-service-next-year/2470834

[Solblanc]

I wonder if PAL will get more neos in LR or XLR config. With the XLR they could increase MEL to daily and also resume another departure bank for SYD. Or do CEB-Australia. The XLR can even make it to AUH.

Also, will they keep the mid-galley lavatory for the incoming neos? The 194 seat ceos when retrofitted, will have more space in business class compared to the existing 195-seat neos. But they could in theory keep the extra lav at the expense of economy seat pitch. It’s tight on the CEOs but manageable for the NEOs. Interesting choices up ahead.

What I’d be most curious about is that none of the A321s will be retired anytime soon, so 18 ceos plus 6 LH neos plus 2 SH neos plus the 13 future neos gives us 39 narrow bodies for PAL mainline. Are there even enough slots at NAIA for this, plus 5J’s big aircraft orders? NMIA isn’t coming online anytime soon. I wonder how much growth is heading to CRK and CEB in this regard.

[seven13]

Solblanc wrote

I wonder if PAL will get more neos in LR or XLR config. With the XLR they could increase MEL to daily and also resume another departure bank for SYD. Or do CEB-Australia. The XLR can even make it to AUH.

Also, will they keep the mid-galley lavatory for the incoming neos? The 194 seat ceos when retrofitted, will have more space in business class compared to the existing 195-seat neos. But they could in theory keep the extra lav at the expense of economy seat pitch. It’s tight on the CEOs but manageable for the NEOs. Interesting choices up ahead.

What I’d be most curious about is that none of the A321s will be retired anytime soon, so 18 ceos plus 6 LH neos plus 2 SH neos plus the 13 future neos gives us 39 narrow bodies for PAL mainline. Are there even enough slots at NAIA for this, plus 5J’s big aircraft orders? NMIA isn’t coming online anytime soon. I wonder how much growth is heading to CRK and CEB in this regard.

the upcoming ones which is slated to resume delivery next year would most probably be the same config as 9937/9938. 3 ECY lavatories, one just after bcl and 2 at the rear. What is surprising is PAL opted out for the bigger OHBs and compact lavatories but instead went for the traditional sized ones. I've been on starwalker's A21Ns and LH's, those compact lavs are soo tight.

[filipinoavgeek]

Are the new A321neos that PR ordered planned to replace the A321ceos, or just to supplement them?

[seven13]

filipinoavgeek wrote

Are the new A321neos that PR ordered planned to replace the A321ceos, or just to supplement them?

If my memory is right I think the ceos are originally intended for GAP. But with PR refurbishing all of it, I would not be surprised if some units will stay with PR to supplement the neos coming in. This will enable PR to increase frequency and capacity to key cities. It can withdraw the LRs from doing regional runs and fly it to farther cities like BOM/DEL/CTS while the neos/ceos do SIN/BKK/KUL/PEK.

PR will start flying to Saipan 2x a week starting summer schedule. GAP will fly the route.

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/251207-prns26spn

Would anyone know how PR decides which international flight it will fly with its own metal and which routes will be flown with GAP?

[markpaul]

PHILIPPINE AIRLINES PLANS SAIPAN LAUNCH IN NS26


Philippine Airlines in Northern summer 2026 season plans to launch service on Manila – Saipan route, operated by PAL Express Airbus A321 aircraft. The airline will operate 2 weekly flights from 29MAR26.

PR2571 MNL1945 – 0145+1SPN 321 37
PR2572 SPN0250 – 0505MNL 321 14

[Arianespace]

Solblanc wrote

I wonder if PAL will get more neos in LR or XLR config. With the XLR they could increase MEL to daily and also resume another departure bank for SYD. Or do CEB-Australia. The XLR can even make it to AUH.

Also, will they keep the mid-galley lavatory for the incoming neos? The 194 seat ceos when retrofitted, will have more space in business class compared to the existing 195-seat neos. But they could in theory keep the extra lav at the expense of economy seat pitch. It’s tight on the CEOs but manageable for the NEOs. Interesting choices up ahead.

What I’d be most curious about is that none of the A321s will be retired anytime soon, so 18 ceos plus 6 LH neos plus 2 SH neos plus the 13 future neos gives us 39 narrow bodies for PAL mainline. Are there even enough slots at NAIA for this, plus 5J’s big aircraft orders? NMIA isn’t coming online anytime soon. I wonder how much growth is heading to CRK and CEB in this regard.

They might actually would, as the LR with published 4,000nm range would only provide them with 168 seats (12J,156Y) for its farthest flight to MEL. Iberia, the first XLR operator, said the real world range of the XLR plane at 182 seats (14J 168Y) is merely 3,920nm. With PAL current configuration, they could fly the XLR to 4,300nm effectively covering the middle east.

Having the XLR would give PAL more flexibility in payload, AUS being its primary target market from the route planning inception in 2012 where RSA intends to operate B757 to initially open the route.

QFA ordered the A321XLR specifically for its payload capabilities rather than for its range. XLR would certainly be an upgrade for PAL current LR fleet. And besides, flying multiple A321XLRs rather than a single Airbus A330  yields higher revenue.

Having said that, they could also service the gulf regions KWI, AUH, BAH, OMA which is not filled easily with A330.

Certainly that is in the minds of Nuttall. No doubt about it. As to the slots, there are two terminals to be open soon.

filipinoavgeek wrote

Are the new A321neos that PR ordered planned to replace the A321ceos, or just to supplement them?

Supplement. The original order in 2012 was for 44 a321s divided into 34ceo and 10neo.

seven13 wrote

If my memory is right I think the ceos are originally intended for GAP.

Would anyone know how PR decides which international flight it will fly with its own metal and which routes will be flown with GAP?

10 ceo frames was originally allocated for GAP domestic and international operations. It managed to operate only 5 as some international points were taken by PAL. GUM and SPN was once operated by GAP in 2016 flying at T3. PAL is relaunching it next year on the same arrangement. This is how their schedule went:

Flight PR1571 departs Manila every Wednesday and Sunday at 9:20 pm and arrives in Saipan at 3:35 am local time the following day.

Flight PR1572 departs Saipan every Thursday and Monday at 4:35 am local time and arrives in Manila at 6:45 am.

[filipinoavgeek]

Why is it 2P that's operating MNL-SPN rather than mainline PR? Even in the past when PAL served the same route, it was also with 2P and not mainline.

How will that work too? They will use 2P planes, but still out of Terminal 1? Terminal 2 does not serve international flights anymore.

Also, with how they also serve other low-capacity routes like KTI, would it be in PR's interest to order even a few A320neos like 5J has done? Those could even be deployed to some of the other routes like CTS during more lean times.

[JNC03]

First PAL A35K on second test flight while the second one is already spotted in TLS




📷: Alan Pardoe

[Arianespace]

filipinoavgeek wrote

Why is it 2P that's operating MNL-SPN rather than mainline PR? Even in the past when PAL served the same route, it was also with 2P and not mainline.

Mostly associated with flight cost, secondary to slot allocation, and thirdly, air traffic rights. If you remember, 2P also operated DXB on the same principle, but ended up to a different result. OFW preferred PAL. Codeshares doesn't seem to impress them. 2P were allotted 6 of the 6x A333 fleet, and DXB was a test in the water. It did not float. The low cost idea was good but it did not worked. So they reverted back to mainline.
 

[romantic_guy08]

5J to launch MNL - RUH starting March 1, 2026

[Solblanc]

Curious. I wonder why RUH, and not say JED or DMM. JED is the HQ of flyadeal and DMM has no service.

On these flights, comfort-wise, there's practically no difference between PAL and Cebpac save for the food. I wonder if this can push PAL out, especially when Riyadh Air starts operations.

[filipinoavgeek]

To Arianespace or anyone here: do you know if 5J or any other airline is planning to launch either MNL-OKA or MNL-PEN? Both routes are currently unserved, but analysis as shown that the demand is there to warrant a few weekly flights. It was the same analysis that mentioned MNL-CTS and MNL-CNX (this was before 5J launched both). With 5J still getting new aircraft, and PR having more A321neos coming, maybe there is an opening to launch more Southeast Asian flights? Both airlines seem rather weak in their Southeast Asian networks compared to their peers like AirAsia and Malaysian Airlines.

[Gustavo J Oppenheimer]

I believe AirAsia had set sights to fly to OKA either as a direct flight or fifth freedom via Taipei. Was supposed to be this year but lack of available aircraft was probably the reason why it hasn't been launched

[Arianespace]

Solblanc wrote

Curious. I wonder why RUH, and not say JED or DMM. JED is the HQ of flyadeal and DMM has no service.

On these flights, comfort-wise, there's practically no difference between PAL and Cebpac save for the food. I wonder if this can push PAL out, especially when Riyadh Air starts operations.

Wait for it

[Arianespace]

Still, with 5J, CEB is proud to welcome RP-C4165, its newest A320 with 197 seats and 26 inches  of legroom, yay. Its sibling RP-C4166 and the rest of its newer fleet with similar configuration is on the way too!

filipinoavgeek wrote

To Arianespace or anyone here: do you know if 5J or any other airline is planning to launch either MNL-OKA or MNL-PEN? Both routes are currently unserved, but analysis as shown that the demand is there to warrant a few weekly flights. It was the same analysis that mentioned MNL-CTS and MNL-CNX (this was before 5J launched both). With 5J still getting new aircraft, and PR having more A321neos coming, maybe there is an opening to launch more Southeast Asian flights? Both airlines seem rather weak in their Southeast Asian networks compared to their peers like AirAsia and Malaysian Airlines.

The answer to that question is Philippine demography. All Philippine-based carriers fly Filipinos to places where they are or they want to go, not to places where foreigners are. I learned this from JJB himself along time ago.

Even if PEN is the second biggest City in Malaysia, more Filipinos could be found in Sabah, so there is BKI. Even then, there are more Filipinos transiting Sabah via TWI for Sandakan or Tawau. Just look at CEB flights there. Multiple A320s services for a small island. I tell you, its not about tourism like IAO.

PAL used to fly OKA in the 90s, but it serviced mostly American serviceman. When traffic dropped they ceased operations. The point is if there are plenty of Filipinos there or the place is culturally good for Filipino tourism, ie CTS, then expect Filipino airlines to fly there. Why is PAL flying to Palau or Saipan then? Philippine demography. Historically, they were part of the Philippines. And so does Sabah.

[filipinoavgeek]

Arianespace wrote

Still, with 5J, CEB is proud to welcome RP-C4165, its newest A320 with 197 seats and 26 inches  of legroom, yay. Its sibling RP-C4166 and the rest of its newer fleet with similar configuration is on the way too!

filipinoavgeek wrote

To Arianespace or anyone here: do you know if 5J or any other airline is planning to launch either MNL-OKA or MNL-PEN? Both routes are currently unserved, but analysis as shown that the demand is there to warrant a few weekly flights. It was the same analysis that mentioned MNL-CTS and MNL-CNX (this was before 5J launched both). With 5J still getting new aircraft, and PR having more A321neos coming, maybe there is an opening to launch more Southeast Asian flights? Both airlines seem rather weak in their Southeast Asian networks compared to their peers like AirAsia and Malaysian Airlines.

The answer to that question is Philippine demography. All Philippine-based carriers fly Filipinos to places where they are or they want to go, not to places where foreigners are. I learned this from JJB himself along time ago.

Even if PEN is the second biggest City in Malaysia, more Filipinos could be found in Sabah, so there is BKI. Even then, there are more Filipinos transiting Sabah via TWI for Sandakan or Tawau. Just look at CEB flights there. Multiple A320s services for a small island. I tell you, its not about tourism like IAO.

PAL used to fly OKA in the 90s, but it serviced mostly American serviceman. When traffic dropped they ceased operations. The point is if there are plenty of Filipinos there or the place is culturally good for Filipino tourism, ie CTS, then expect Filipino airlines to fly there. Why is PAL flying to Palau or Saipan then? Philippine demography. Historically, they were part of the Philippines. And so does Sabah.

As you said, the CTS flights are not just about tourism but also the Filipino community in Hokkaido right? As for CNX and DAD, I can't imagine the Filipino communities there being big, and as far as I know, those routes were intended to be for tourists and not the diaspora. Penang and Okinawa could be stimulated as tourist destinations as well. The reason I'm asking because of that one analysis stating that there is a demand for those routes. With Penang, I imagine that might be a mix of Malaysians and Filipinos, with Okinawa it could be more with Japanese tourists, but I imagine there's also a Filipino community there especially with the shared American military heritage.

[Arianespace]

Filipino diaspora in Vietnam is big. It is bigger than Thailand. As you may know, most western-based companies having factories there hire Filipinos due to their fluency of the English language. For this reason, the Vietnamese government hires English teachers from the Philippines to teach the locals. Just like China did. And the Filipinos there told their friends here about Vietnam and how cheap it is to travel there.

Tourism wise, Just for the first quarter of 2025, over 71,000 Filipinos visited Vietnam, a nearly 100% increase from the previous year. Pinoy travelers makes a country popular. HVN passengers are mostly Filipinos.

I once saw demand figures for MNL-OKA at OAG before. Cannot find them now, but it was dismal. Twice a week A319 service couldn't even cut it. That is how low it was. But that was before Covid.

As for CNX, passengers preferred BKK stopover. PAL stopped eventually because of poor yield. But that was also before covid.

[seven13]

Solblanc wrote

Curious. I wonder why RUH, and not say JED or DMM. JED is the HQ of flyadeal and DMM has no service.

On these flights, comfort-wise, there's practically no difference between PAL and Cebpac save for the food. I wonder if this can push PAL out, especially when Riyadh Air starts operations.

I doubt if it can; there’s probably room for 3 carriers for RUH just like PR, 5J and EK can coexist on the DXB route.